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RE: Saints Bounty Thread - ATLBound - 06-06-2012 01:57 PM
Here it goes y'all...
Yesterday Shanle didn't play with the first team offense during the second session of OTA's. They replaced him with Chamberlain.
*Cue Guido logic*
Guido: "Shanle has a reason to lie because he felt slighted by being placed on the second team in OTA's"
Did I get that right Guido?
RE: Saints Bounty Thread - Drathdon - 06-06-2012 02:01 PM
Shanle is just trying to continue painting the picture the players are counting on, that of blaming it all on Williams to lessen their personal impact. They asked for the audio to be released to blame Williams. They say the language was all Williams.
I hate a cheat, but I doubly hate anyone that tries to shift the blame when they are caught, even though they were complicit. These guys have no class.
RE: Saints Bounty Thread - pauliwood - 06-06-2012 02:26 PM
(06-06-2012 12:05 PM)RFlagg Wrote: Pretty much what I picture is being said every time I see the mini bar showing Guido has posted, yet I don't have to read it.
I'm starting to like that mini bar.
RE: Saints Bounty Thread - TeamPlayer1 - 06-06-2012 02:52 PM
Gregg Williams knows exactly what transpired in the bounty case and he is the smoking gun. Do any of you think he would not spill his guts for an opportunity to resume his well paid career?
RE: Saints Bounty Thread - phocis850 - 06-06-2012 03:14 PM
(06-06-2012 01:45 PM)ATLBound Wrote: P.S.S Dammit I am on my phone again. Phocis or somebody may I please have my 'rolleyes' smiley face again
RE: Saints Bounty Thread - Beef - 06-06-2012 03:51 PM
(06-06-2012 11:13 AM)AsylumGuido Wrote: Once again, there is no evidence of intent to injure. Yes, there was intent to knock the snot out of your opponent, but on every single snap of every single game there is that intent.
What Goodell painted the Saints as doing was far more egregious than anything that has been shown to have happened. Every bit of evidence that has been shared or leaked has pointed to nothing more than a reward and penalty program that is common place in sports. Wrong? Yes. But nothing to the extent that Goodell has indicated from the beginning.
First of all, there IS evidence of intent to injure. You can't interpret "cart-offs" as meaning anything else. You keep ignoring this, but you're being obnoxiously disingenuous and misleading by doing so.
You're trying to contend that because no injury has been shown (YET) to match up with a "cart-off" $1000 payment, that this means there is no intent to injure, but you're just wrong. GW's locker room speech caught on video proves that "knocking someone out" of a game was one of their goals. And how exactly does one get knocked out of a game if not due to being injured????? You pair that up with the confirmation of a ledger showing payments/rewards for cart-offs, as now substantiated by Shanle, and the fact that you simply can't interpret the meaning of "cart-offs" any other way, it's 100% clear that there absolutely IS proof of intent to injure.
Second of all, this article is yet another biased as hell Times-Picayune pile of garbage. It's only redeeming quality is that Shanle is substantiating that the ledger and "cart-offs" did in fact exist and the Saints had a very organized bounty program.
But the crap about Hargrove's declaration is pure misrepresentation of the truth, a flat lie in fact. Just like you and every other NO fan in denial with blinders on and purposely misinterpreting context, you refuse to acknowledge the true context, inferences, and logic behind Hargrove's declaration.
Nobody gets told to play dumb, stay on the same page, and lie about something that supposedly doesn't even exist. And nobody goes and throws their coaches under the bus trying to pass culpability to them in an attempt to reduce your own punishment if the meaning behind your declaration is that you were never involved in what you were actually punished for. Obviously, to pass GW and Vitt responsibility, there has to be something for them to be responsible for. As a result, THERE HAS to be a bounty program that includes pay for injury, since that on top of lying, is what Hargrove is suspended for.
And to top all that off, now that the ledger has been substantiated by Shanle, the inferences I'm explaining are behind Hargrove's declaration are even that much more logical to be the real truth.
Like I said, you've lost, Guido. Nothing you say has any truth to it and your flat out ignoring of the evidence is asinine. "Cart-off" = intent to injure no matter how much you ignore it and say otherwise.
RE: Saints Bounty Thread - ATLBound - 06-06-2012 04:39 PM
That's a good point Beef...I never thought of it that way. To reiterate:
Exhibit A is the Hargrove declaration
Looking at purely the context of the Exhibit A then Guido can say that it doesn't outright mention a pay for injure program.
Now although there are plenty of people who can use logic and say there is a pay for injure program involved, otherwise there is no reason to lie, it doesn't fully commit to it because of the context and that's fine for him to interpret it that way because obviously he wants the opposite to be true.
But what Guido has to realize is that Goodell, Mary Jo White, and whomever else that has seen all or most of the evidence are looking at the evidence that they have which consists of ledgers, testimonies, and whatever else they have combined with the declaration and we can see clearly how it admits to a pay for injury program.
Even from just combining the ledger with the declaration and now Shanle's comments it admits to a pay for injure program. This is disregarding the other pieces of evidence that the NFL has.
The only way that Shanle comments helps the Saints is by advising essentially that the punishment doesn't fit the crime but there is clearly a crime there to punish.
Unfortunately for Shanle and the Saints the person who rules on the crime is the only person that matters and if Goodell feels that the ounishment fits the crime then you have to adhere. What Saints fans and apologists should REALLY be looking at is if there wasn't a crime to punish then you wouldn't be in this perdicament. There is nobody else ro blame but yourselves.
Abd Guido is going to hate this and others may not agree, but Shanle's comments have changed my tune about one thing. I was not one to put an asterisk on the Saints SB, but Shanle said that GW was one the best motivator ever and if part of his motovation was to offer additional money and also take away money for mental mistakes then that is an illegal advantage that the Saints had over their competition. Now we can say that all NFL teams do it and that may be true but 2 things hurt that. One the other NFL teams have not been found guilty in that regard and Two Shanle said that this was the most organized bounty program he has ever been a part of.
This is evidence that the lobger this thing drags on, the morenpeople talk, the more evidence that comea out, the more minds that will change and the worst it gets for the Saints. You should be praying now that they give up and take as is. Your hopes of dragging it on have come true but your dreams of it helping didn't.
RE: Saints Bounty Thread - Jimusmc - 06-06-2012 05:39 PM
LOL this dude still trying to say no intent to injure.
i think he's officially gone mad.
RE: Saints Bounty Thread - TeamPlayer1 - 06-06-2012 07:40 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--source--roman-harper--jo-lonn-dunbar-offered-payments-by-saints-assistant-during-playoffs.html;_ylt=AnHnlmKm8aqIxZRnZ7jgLOVDubYFHarper and Dunbar are now implicated and the Nfl could reopen the investigation. This never gets old!
RE: Saints Bounty Thread - pauliwood - 06-06-2012 08:13 PM
(06-06-2012 07:40 PM)TeamPlayer1 Wrote: Harper and Dunbar are now implicated and the Nfl could reopen the investigation. This never gets old!
Link?