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+--- Thread: Falcons: The safety that magically was taken away (/Thread-Falcons-The-safety-that-magically-was-taken-away)
RE: The safety that magically was taken away - juraitwaluzka - 12-29-2011 04:19 PM
(12-29-2011 03:46 PM)cooperbh Wrote: I've never been one to buy into conspiracies surrounding Katrina and all that bullshit. But there was no doubt to any objective observer that the #1 goal of the officiating crew in Monday's game was to ensure that Drew Brees received as many chances as possible to throw the ball - especially near the end of the game. And if you don't see that, it's only because you have your eyes closed.
I know it seems like that, but in order for that to be the case, where did the order come from? Did Goodell tell the refs to favor the Saints? That doesn't make sense, because however much good might come from Brees getting the record it would be far (and I mean FAR) outweighed if word of this got out. In fact it would be devastating to the league and as such Goodell wouldn't do this because it's simply not worth the risk. At the least it would certainly cost Goodell his job.
What about the refs? Would they take it upon themselves to do this? This would be easier to get away with but I don't see the motivation. Plus it seems likely that at least one of the refs would take issue with it. I could see how a particular ref, Tripplette in this case, could let whatever agenda he may have drive his decisions, especially with nothing in place to even question him on it, no way to prove it. I don't see why one guy would care about Brees record though, but maybe he just loves the Saints, or maybe our guys pissed him off and he decided to "show us". Those are the only conspiracy type things I could see realistically.
The simplest explanation though is that it was just incompetence, which has been demonstrated many times over.
RE: The safety that magically was taken away - cooperbh - 12-29-2011 04:50 PM
(12-29-2011 04:19 PM)juraitwaluzka Wrote: I know it seems like that, but in order for that to be the case, where did the order come from? Did Goodell tell the refs to favor the Saints? That doesn't make sense, because however much good might come from Brees getting the record it would be far (and I mean FAR) outweighed if word of this got out. In fact it would be devastating to the league and as such Goodell wouldn't do this because it's simply not worth the risk. At the least it would certainly cost Goodell his job.
How would word ever get out? It only takes one simple remark to set something like this in motion:
"Hey, Jeff. It's Carl (NFL VP of Officiating.) Roger and I were talking the other day about how it would be great if Drew Brees broke Marino's record in front of a national audience, know what what I'm saying?"
So, who's going to come forward and disclose this non-evidence and why? It would take owners pressing the issue for anything to ever come to light. Seeing as Goodell is just a puppet of the owners, that is never going to happen and he knows it.
Do you believe Bud Selig didn't know MacGuire and Sosa were juicing? Because if he did know, it would surely have cost him his job, right?
These are very powerful men we're talking about here. It takes more than simple hearsay to bring someone like that down.
RE: The safety that magically was taken away - juraitwaluzka - 12-29-2011 05:18 PM
Word could get out if for whatever reason Jeff decided not to play ball, or if he decided he wanted a little something to keep his mouth shut, or at some point in the future he decided the NFL gave him the shaft and now he's going to spill the beans. That's the risk. I'm not saying that's what would happen, but it could and anyone doing something that could damage the integrity of the game would be a fool not to weigh the risks. Is the record worth risking potentially seeing an NFL ref on 60 minutes? Proof doesn't matter to the paying public, perception is more than enough.
If you're going to do a conspiracy and get away with it you have to either have full trust of everyone involved (nearly impossible with untrained humans) or leverage (ie we'll kill your family if you talk), otherwise, sooner or later someone is going to talk, it's human nature.
Besides, it doesn't have to be provable. You don't think the media would feast on something like this, even if just a rumor. The shit storm itself is enough of a potential headache where it just doesn't seem like it would be worth the risk. On top of that if Goodell was stupid enough to be that reckless over something as insignificant as a record on a singular night then chances are he would be that way in other areas and would've gotten caught doing something.
That being said, it's not impossible, but it just doesn't seem likely to me.
As for Selig, I don't really follow baseball too closely, but that's a different situation, doesn't really apply here. He may well have known, but as commissioner he would have to have proof of Mac/Sosa juicing and go through the proper channels, there could be legal ramifications if he went out there accusing them of it without proof, unless you are suggesting that Selig was somehow a willing and active participant.
RE: The safety that magically was taken away - cooperbh - 12-29-2011 05:41 PM
(12-29-2011 05:18 PM)juraitwaluzka Wrote: Word could get out if for whatever reason Jeff decided not to play ball, or if he decided he wanted a little something to keep his mouth shut, or at some point in the future he decided the NFL gave him the shaft and now he's going to spill the beans. That's the risk. I'm not saying that's what would happen, but it could and anyone doing something that could damage the integrity of the game would be a fool not to weigh the risks. Is the record worth risking potentially seeing an NFL ref on 60 minutes? Proof doesn't matter to the paying public, perception is more than enough.
If you're going to do a conspiracy and get away with it you have to either have full trust of everyone involved (nearly impossible with untrained humans) or leverage (ie we'll kill your family if you talk), otherwise, sooner or later someone is going to talk, it's human nature.
Besides, it doesn't have to be provable. You don't think the media would feast on something like this, even if just a rumor. The shit storm itself is enough of a potential headache where it just doesn't seem like it would be worth the risk. On top of that if Goodell was stupid enough to be that reckless over something as insignificant as a record on a singular night then chances are he would be that way in other areas and would've gotten caught doing something.
That being said, it's not impossible, but it just doesn't seem likely to me.
As for Selig, I don't really follow baseball too closely, but that's a different situation, doesn't really apply here. He may well have known, but as commissioner he would have to have proof of Mac/Sosa juicing and go through the proper channels, there could be legal ramifications if he went out there accusing them of it without proof, unless you are suggesting that Selig was somehow a willing and active participant.
Anyone that even casually follows baseball knows that Selig was well aware of how rampant steroid use was during the period in question. There's really no way he couldn't have known. And if somehow he was the only person in baseball that had no knowledge of the steroid abuse that was occurring, that would make him too incompetent to be commisioner. And, yet, Selig is still the commissioner of MLB to this day.
According to your reasoning, nobody has ever in the history of humanity committed an illegal or unethical act simply because there is always some risk involved in doing so.
Nevermind that in Goodell's position, as with Selig's, there really is no risk.
RE: The safety that magically was taken away - illmusic - 12-29-2011 05:57 PM
Tim donaghy went on record saying that officiating in the NBA was fucked and certain players and teams got certain treatment...the NBA posted record viewing #s in last year's finals...im not saying that there was a set up, but to believe. That your own judgment in ethics and risk management would make the situation unlikely is naive.
RE: The safety that magically was taken away - AsylumGuido - 12-29-2011 06:33 PM
(12-29-2011 03:46 PM)cooperbh Wrote: I found this tidbit on a little website called "Yahoo" or something:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Adventures-in-Officiating-Jeff-Triplette-is-jus?urn=nfl-wp14832
I've never been one to buy into conspiracies surrounding Katrina and all that bullshit. But there was no doubt to any objective observer that the #1 goal of the officiating crew in Monday's game was to ensure that Drew Brees received as many chances as possible to throw the ball - especially near the end of the game. And if you don't see that, it's only because you have your eyes closed.
It is officially called the Katrina Clause. You are right. The game was fixed.
RE: The safety that magically was taken away - AsylumGuido - 12-29-2011 06:38 PM
(12-29-2011 05:18 PM)juraitwaluzka Wrote: Word could get out if for whatever reason Jeff decided not to play ball, or if he decided he wanted a little something to keep his mouth shut, or at some point in the future he decided the NFL gave him the shaft and now he's going to spill the beans. That's the risk. I'm not saying that's what would happen, but it could and anyone doing something that could damage the integrity of the game would be a fool not to weigh the risks. Is the record worth risking potentially seeing an NFL ref on 60 minutes? Proof doesn't matter to the paying public, perception is more than enough.
If you're going to do a conspiracy and get away with it you have to either have full trust of everyone involved (nearly impossible with untrained humans) or leverage (ie we'll kill your family if you talk), otherwise, sooner or later someone is going to talk, it's human nature.
Besides, it doesn't have to be provable. You don't think the media would feast on something like this, even if just a rumor. The shit storm itself is enough of a potential headache where it just doesn't seem like it would be worth the risk. On top of that if Goodell was stupid enough to be that reckless over something as insignificant as a record on a singular night then chances are he would be that way in other areas and would've gotten caught doing something.
That being said, it's not impossible, but it just doesn't seem likely to me.
As for Selig, I don't really follow baseball too closely, but that's a different situation, doesn't really apply here. He may well have known, but as commissioner he would have to have proof of Mac/Sosa juicing and go through the proper channels, there could be legal ramifications if he went out there accusing them of it without proof, unless you are suggesting that Selig was somehow a willing and active participant.
Just give up. Sometimes sound logic gets in the way of good solid hatred and conspiracy mongering. Join the Katrina Clause gang.
RE: The safety that magically was taken away - illmusic - 12-29-2011 06:47 PM
(12-29-2011 06:38 PM)AsylumGuido Wrote: Just give up. Sometimes sound logic gets in the way of good solid hatred and conspiracy mongering. Join the Katrina Clause gang.
I understand why you'd feel that way...the dismissive attitude is unlike you though
RE: The safety that magically was taken away - AsylumGuido - 12-29-2011 07:01 PM
(12-29-2011 06:47 PM)illmusic Wrote: I understand why you'd feel that way...the dismissive attitude is unlike you though
Sometimes it just isn't worth the trouble to try to have a logical discussion with a fencepost. It is crazy to believe there would be any type of concerted effort to fix an NFL game. There is far, far to much risk for what type of small reward? Would it increase revenues? Would it increase viewership?
It's just silly.
RE: The safety that magically was taken away - illmusic - 12-29-2011 07:05 PM
that's why I don't believe it happened, the reasoning ain't there...but as much shady shit has been swept under the rug regarding sports, its sillier to believe someone wouldn't do this with the right motive.