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cooperbh · 03-09-2012, 07:32 PM

(03-09-2012 06:44 PM)AsylumGuido Wrote: Since this thing was for the most part player run, how do we know that it wasn't the players that came up with all of the reward requirements/categories? That said, they never paid anything for cart-offs. I have watched every minute of every game and the only players carted off the field were two Saints players.

It's strange how whenever Gregg Williams shows up somewhere, his players spontaneously and autonomously decide to set up and run bounty programs. Dumb luck, that.

BTW, the Falcons offense wasn't trying to score in the Giants playoff game. I know this because I watched every minute of that game and they never once scored.

Fucking delusional.

**Radical** · 03-09-2012, 07:40 PM

(03-09-2012 07:15 PM)V Chip Wrote: Only Greg Williams' statement acknowledges a specific wrongdoing, but it's only "pay for performance" and not "pay for injuries."

It is a known fact that wherever Williams went, the bounty system sprung up. Not only that, but it's already known for a fact that there were payments for knocking players out of the game and for cart-offs. Why are you guys still arguing and spinning around in circles trying to skirt around what is already fact?

cooperbh · 03-09-2012, 07:54 PM

(03-09-2012 07:40 PM)Radical Wrote: It is a known fact that wherever Williams went, the bounty system sprung up. Not only that, but it's already known for a fact that there were payments for knocking players out of the game and for cart-offs. Why are you guys still arguing and spinning around in circles trying to skirt around what is already fact?

I believe denial is the first emotion experienced in the five stages of grief. It's completely normal.

Anger is next. Can't wait. Cool

illmusic · 03-09-2012, 08:24 PM

(03-09-2012 07:40 PM)Radical Wrote: It is a known fact that wherever Williams went, the bounty system sprung up. Not only that, but it's already known for a fact that there were payments for knocking players out of the game and for cart-offs. Why are you guys still arguing and spinning around in circles trying to skirt around what is already fact?

paying for cart offs is dirty, if true.

V Chip · 03-09-2012, 11:22 PM

(03-09-2012 07:40 PM)Radical Wrote: It is a known fact that wherever Williams went, the bounty system sprung up. Not only that, but it's already known for a fact that there were payments for knocking players out of the game and for cart-offs. Why are you guys still arguing and spinning around in circles trying to skirt around what is already fact?

But see the problem is you state things are fact when they aren't. Why state "it is a fact that X" when it's not yet known? For example, people were saying it was a fact that Payton/Loomis/Benson/Williams have admitted they ran a pay for injury system when it isn't true. People say it is a fact that everywhere Williams went a pay for injury system came up when all of the teams have denied it and nobody has said the system was in place in Tennessee or Jacksonville. It very well could have been but stating is as a FACT when it isn't yet is wrong. It's like saying it is a FACT that man is causing global warming/climate change -- there might be lots of data to back it up, and it might turn out to be true, but right now it is NOT a fact. I don't see why people are so intent of assuming everything is already cut and dried and done when it isn't. It might be true -- heck it likely is! -- but acting as if it already is to ME weakens your argument.

Anyway I'm going to bow out before I get called a troll. I'm not saying the Saints are blameless or that they're being unfairly targeted because that would be stupid. I'm just saying that people have made up their minds and are 100% convinced on partial evidence and hearsay. Again they might be right, but it's not based on 100% facts -- yet.

Beef · 03-10-2012, 09:58 AM

Except that Coy Wire already got on the radio with 790 The Zone and stated that for a FACT Greg Williams instituted a pay for injuries (and performance) bounty system in both Buffalo and Washington where he played under Williams at both before coming to the Falcons.

And it's not just Coy Wire who has confirmed this. You're not only in denial, V, but you haven't done your homework and your making ignorant arguments.

ATLBound · 03-10-2012, 10:10 AM

(03-08-2012 09:02 PM)Radical Wrote: Umm... yes it does. It proves the coaches encouraged it, and the players actively participated in it. What other kind of proof could possibly be needed?

Exactly. Does anybody really think that with money on the table it doesnt cause more maliscious hits to happen? I have said multiple times. Its not about the legal hits. Those are fine regardless pf the result. Its just partnof the game. The thing most of is are discussing which defenders need to get consistent on are malicious hits, illegal hits...whatever u want to call them

ATLBound · 03-10-2012, 10:18 AM

For all the defenders, here is a newsletter: We, the "attackers", are not discussing legal hits. Those are part of the game. We, the "attackers", are not discussing the ultimate result on the field of said "bounty" program. We are discussing the illegal bits that are encouraged AND the possibility of hurting someone in a significant way because of those illegal hits. Please understand that if there was 1 player, just 1, that was brutally injured because of an illegal hit during these past 3 years then ALL of the defenders wouldn't have anything

It is not hard to understand how POTENTIALLY dangerous something like this could have been. If I attempt to murder someone but fail. My ass is still going to jail regardless if it actually resulted in a murder.

V Chip · 03-10-2012, 05:44 PM

(03-10-2012 09:58 AM)Beef Wrote: Except that Coy Wire already got on the radio with 790 The Zone and stated that for a FACT Greg Williams instituted a pay for injuries (and performance) bounty system in both Buffalo and Washington where he played under Williams at both before coming to the Falcons.

And it's not just Coy Wire who has confirmed this. You're not only in denial, V, but you haven't done your homework and your making ignorant arguments.

FYI: Coy Wire never played in Washington. Coy Wire made no statement about the Redskins having a bounty. This is exactly the type of thing I am talking about with people referring to FACTS that aren't.

Both Jacksonville and Tennessee have had nobody admit to a bounty system, and so far nobody is accusing those two teams of having it (beyond the "Williams worked there, I wonder if they had one too?" speculation).

So have at it with your "facts." I'm not in denial -- the Saints are gonna get whomped with the big stick by the league and deservedly so -- but I'm also not making up "facts" to try and make my case seem better.

dmo_dlo · (This post was last modified: 03-10-2012 08:08 PM by dmo_dlo.)

(03-10-2012 05:44 PM)V Chip Wrote: FYI: Coy Wire never played in Washington. Coy Wire made no statement about the Redskins having a bounty. This is exactly the type of thing I am talking about with people referring to FACTS that aren't.

Both Jacksonville and Tennessee have had nobody admit to a bounty system, and so far nobody is accusing those two teams of having it (beyond the "Williams worked there, I wonder if they had one too?" speculation).

So have at it with your "facts." I'm not in denial -- the Saints are gonna get whomped with the big stick by the league and deservedly so -- but I'm also not making up "facts" to try and make my case seem better.

Wire was talking about Buffalo, what difference does it make? He was talking about his experience in a Williams-led team.

Williams admitted he did run a bounty system. Washington ran a bounty system under Williams (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/201...gton-too/)

So it really look like you're in denial that you're in denial.