NFL: Russell Wilson should be ROY.

[AUTiger7222]

(01-01-2013 11:51 AM)Mr. Patch Wrote:  I'd take RG3 and Wilson over Luck for ROY.

Yeah, the Colts went from 2-14 to 11-5, but how much of that 2-14 season is because the Colts had the bright idea to start Curtis Painter at QB for half a season.

How many veteran players did the Colts get rid of in favor of younger unproven talent? A ton.

[RnB]

I think Wilson is simply a better football player than the other rooks this season and deserves ROY. He seems to be the final piece that helped the Seahawks go from slightly above average (in the playoff hunt for a few seasons) to pretty damn good.

RG3 will probably get it due to media hype. He is a good player in the same vein that Vick was good when he first came into the league (I would take Vick over RG3 as rookies, all else being equal), but he was hurt multiple times and their offense is super gimmicky (one year of tape will cause them to have to switch things up). The sports media has a lot of sway in this type of shit, unfortunately, and RG3 has gotten the most coverage of any player this season by far.

Luck may get it as well, due to the media hyping the coach with cancer story and the disparity in win/loss from last season, but I think his receiving corps makes him look better than he is at this point. You also have to factor in the division he plays in and the bigger Indy story (Peyton) that is taking place out west which could overshadow anything Luck did this year.

[AUTiger7222]

(01-01-2013 01:27 PM)RnB Wrote:  I think Wilson is simply a better football player than the other rooks this season and deserves ROY. He seems to be the final piece that helped the Seahawks go from slightly above average (in the playoff hunt for a few seasons) to pretty damn good.

RG3 will probably get it due to media hype. He is a good player in the same vein that Vick was good when he first came into the league (I would take Vick over RG3 as rookies, all else being equal), but he was hurt multiple times and their offense is super gimmicky (one year of tape will cause them to have to switch things up). The sports media has a lot of sway in this type of shit, unfortunately, and RG3 has gotten the most coverage of any player this season by far.

Luck may get it as well, due to the media hyping the coach with cancer story and the disparity in win/loss from last season, but I think his receiving corps makes him look better than he is at this point. You also have to factor in the division he plays in and the bigger Indy story (Peyton) that is taking place out west which could overshadow anything Luck did this year.

Really? Luck's receiving corps makes him look better than he really is? He has Reggie Wayne which is better than anyone that RG3 and Russell Wilson has to throw to. But after that there is a huge dropoff.

Donnie Avery? Meh
T.Y. Hilton? He's got some talent but he's a rookie too. So no real advantage there.
Dwayne Allen? Who?
Coby Fleener? Someone he's used to throwing too but Fleener missed 4 games with injuries.
Austin Collie? He's talented but he's always hurt. Played 1 game this season and made 1 catch.

His leading rusher is Vick Ballard, yet another rookie. Pretty impressive what the Colts did on offense with all these rookies and injuries.

[RnB]

(01-01-2013 04:26 PM)AUTiger7222 Wrote:  Really? Luck's receiving corps makes him look better than he really is? He has Reggie Wayne which is better than anyone that RG3 and Russell Wilson has to throw to. But after that there is a huge dropoff.

Donnie Avery? Meh
T.Y. Hilton? He's got some talent but he's a rookie too. So no real advantage there.
Dwayne Allen? Who?
Coby Fleener? Someone he's used to throwing too but Fleener missed 4 games with injuries.
Austin Collie? He's talented but he's always hurt. Played 1 game this season and made 1 catch.

His leading rusher is Vick Ballard, yet another rookie. Pretty impressive what the Colts did on offense with all these rookies and injuries.

They almost have two 1000 yard receivers in Wayne and Hilton, they almost have a 1000 yard back in Ballard (and some guy that almost broke 500), Luck is sixth in pass attempts for the season, and has almost as many Ints as TDs. Yes, Luck's receivers (and how much they pass) make him look better than he is. Do I think he is a terrible football player? No. I think he will turn into a fine QB as he gets more experience. Do I think he has had a better rookie year than Wilson? No.

EDIT: Wow, just looked at their schedule and am not surprised they made the playoffs: TENx2, JACx2, NYJ, MIA, CLE, BUF, DET, KC. I am leaning further away from Luck as an outstanding rookie than I was previously.

[AUTiger7222]

(01-01-2013 05:39 PM)RnB Wrote:  They almost have two 1000 yard receivers in Wayne and Hilton, they almost have a 1000 yard back in Ballard (and some guy that almost broke 500), Luck is sixth in pass attempts for the season, and has almost as many Ints as TDs. Yes, Luck's receivers (and how much they pass) make him look better than he is. Do I think he is a terrible football player? No. I think he will turn into a fine QB as he gets more experience. Do I think he has had a better rookie year than Wilson? No.

EDIT: Wow, just looked at their schedule and am not surprised they made the playoffs: TENx2, JACx2, NYJ, MIA, CLE, BUF, DET, KC. I am leaning further away from Luck as an outstanding rookie than I was previously.

So the fact that they're all rookies (Luck, Hilton, Ballard, Fleener) means nothing to you? Yes they played a last place schedule. That's what happens when you finish in last place the year before just like the Falcons played a last place schedule in 2008.

[ATLBound]

(01-01-2013 06:21 PM)AUTiger7222 Wrote:  So the fact that they're all rookies (Luck, Hilton, Ballard, Fleener) means nothing to you? Yes they played a last place schedule. That's what happens when you finish in last place the year before just like the Falcons played a last place schedule in 2008.

Wilson did play tougher competition. That makes a difference. For comparison, think about it like this.

Would Wilson and the Seahawks make it to the SB playing the Colts schedule?

Now

Would Luck and the Colts make the playoffs playing the Seahawks?

Its not a major factor because ultimately you play whomever is on your schedule but it could be a key determining factor.

All in all each player would be a good choice and there are certain factors that point towards each player positively and negatively.

[RnB]

No, I don't care that they are playing a few rookies. Even if I did, it would not do much to shape my opinion on deciding the best rookie this season.

[AUTiger7222]

(01-01-2013 06:34 PM)ATLBound Wrote:  Wilson did play tougher competition. That makes a difference. For comparison, think about it like this.

Would Wilson and the Seahawks make it to the SB playing the Colts schedule?

Now

Would Luck and the Colts make the playoffs playing the Seahawks?

Its not a major factor because ultimately you play whomever is on your schedule but it could be a key determining factor.

All in all each player would be a good choice and there are certain factors that point towards each player positively and negatively.

I didn't say the schedule didn't make a difference. But I think it's stupid to hold schedules against teams. They can't decide who they play.

[RnB]

(01-01-2013 09:54 PM)AUTiger7222 Wrote:  I didn't say the schedule didn't make a difference. But I think it's stupid to hold schedules against teams. They can't decide who they play.

Holding SoS against entire teams, I agree.

However, when judging the stats and overall worth of a single player, the teams they played against directly impacts it. When you play ten teams with less than 5 wins each (no clue how many wins those teams I listed earlier have, but I know they are all fucking terrible), and pass the ball 30+ times every game, of course your passing yards will be inflated.

The only reason Luck is even on the radar is due to his yardage, Chuck Pagano, and the fact that they squeaked into the playoffs this year after losing Peyton and having a terrible season. He is a good QB, don't get me wrong, but not deserving of ROY over Wilson.

[McUser]

I'd vote Wilson. I love that kid. I've been talking him up since his senior year at Wisconsin. If I had to pick a non Atlanta team it'd be Seattle. Because of Wilson.