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Beef · 03-20-2013, 01:20 PM

(03-20-2013 01:06 PM)Swift Is a Die Hard Wrote: we didnt lose because our defense? Our defense gave up 28 points and couldnt sustain a 17-0 point lead at home. Our defense was exploited by Collin K and Russell Wilson to Davis and Zach Miller . Our defense was exposed by Eli Manning in 2nd half of Giants playoff game and Aaron Rodgers came into the dome and put on a clinic . yet we didnt lose because our defense.? Yes our offense is to blame for the Ryan turnovers hurt and they had a chance to win the game with ball in his hands but Ryan and offense didnt come through but the defense has been a issue for 5 seasons.

Now we cut our only pass rusher . we cut Dunta even though he was horrid in pass coverage and we lost a good dlineman in Walker.

It was clearly a combination of both. The defense wouldn't have been on the field allowing TE's to catch balls everywhere and 49'ers to score if the offense didn't go 3 and out several times.

Use your head here. If the offense ate up the clock marching down the field and kept the 49'ers offense off the field more times than our offense was on the field, then we could have won (not lost) that way too.

Turner didn't help that happen. If he would have, this discussion right now isn't happening.

It goes both ways. Both sides of the ball are to blame. Again you are being so unreasonable by trying to pin it all on just defense. And you and we know you're doing that just so you can keep going on complaining about the defense and TD.

You want to be taken seriously? Then get realistic and stay honest. You're not either of those, so you end up being looked down upon here and everywhere.

Swift Is a Die Hard · 03-20-2013, 01:20 PM

(03-20-2013 01:09 PM)Beef Wrote: Again, we are still $7.3M under the cap. Matt is a $12M cap hit. If we give him a new contract now, it will likely free up $4-6M more in cap space.

So with $11-13M more in cap space, lets act like we go get Freeney for a 3-year $15M, $5M guaranteed deal and he's only a $3M cap hit this year. Now we have $8-10M for rookies.

Then TD trades our 30th(1st), 60th(2nd), and $128th(4th) this year, plus next year's 1st round pick with the Jets at #9 and we grab Jarvis Jones.

Then with our 92nd(3rd) pick, we get a CB and our 133rd(4th-comp) we grab a DT or LB.

Now we got a macked out offense along with Freeney and Jones rushing the passer, McClain and Asante on the outside with Franks/Owens/rookie in the nickel, and a big fat 330 lb NT for 3-4 sets. And maybe DT/NT Travian Robertson, LB Pat Schiller, CB Terrence Johnson, CB Peyton Thompson, and DE's Matthews and Massaquoi might just step up and play well too.

There's still a lot of time and a lot of moves that could potentially happen. To discount any of these hypotheticals and claim they're impossible is foolish. Anything could still happen. We're not done.

I think you are looking at glass as half full. The Ryan contract is going to take months to iron out. TD has already stated when the time is right. Not even sure talks have begun. Now we are trading future draft picks again for Jones who could have down the road medical issues. Thats just crazy talk at this time

I think from point its safe to say we are not going to bring in any big names. Osi, Elvis, Freeny or even Abe back. I dont think Seymour does much for us anyway but he is a vet min possibility

we shall see but I think plan this off season is give the young guys a shot. watch

Swift Is a Die Hard · 03-20-2013, 01:23 PM

(03-20-2013 01:20 PM)Beef Wrote: It was clearly a combination of both. The defense wouldn't have been on the field allowing TE's to catch balls everywhere and 49'ers to score if the offense didn't go 3 and out several times.

Use your head here. If the offense ate up the clock marching down the field and kept the 49'ers offense off the field more times than our offense was on the field, then we could have won (not lost) that way too.

Turner didn't help that happen. If he would have, this discussion right now isn't happening.

It goes both ways. Both sides of the ball are to blame. Again you are being so unreasonable by trying to pin it all on just defense. And you and we know you're doing that just so you can keep going on complaining about the defense and TD.

You want to be taken seriously? Then get realistic and stay honest. You're not either of those, so you end up being looked down upon here and everywhere.

Turner didnt have a great game vs Seahawks ? Turner was hurt in 2nd half of SF49ERS game he hurt his ankle. The game plan was not to run vs 49ers.
Both sides are to blame. More like the mistakes of Ryan, the fumble and int hurt the momentum and when he had a chance to win the game on the drive he came up short. Koetter also made some questionable play calls. It was a team LOSS but our defense should have put together a better effort vs two young QBs

We didnt lose in playoffs cause lack of rushing game. we lost cause our LBS were exposed in pass coverage and our run defense was shredded in 49ers games and add the mistakes Ryan and offense made with the fumble snap and int

Beef · 03-20-2013, 01:29 PM

(03-20-2013 01:20 PM)Swift Is a Die Hard Wrote: I think you are looking at glass as half full. The Ryan contract is going to take months to iron out. TD has already stated when the time is right. Not even sure talks have begun. Now we are trading future draft picks again for Jones who could have down the road medical issues. Thats just crazy talk at this time

I think from point its safe to say we are not going to bring in any big names. Osi, Elvis, Freeny or even Abe back. I dont think Seymour does much for us anyway but he is a vet min possibility

we shall see but I think plan this off season is give the young guys a shot. watch

I guess you missed the part where multiple doctors have cleared Jarvis Jones and said he was misdiagnosed with spinal stenosis. He doesn't have that condition and never has. And he's not an injury prone player.

And again, that's all fantasy stuff. I'm not claiming this is what we will do. But you're acting like there's nothing left, that we're done, and we're going to be horrible no matter who we draft.

We have cap space to do more and we have a lot of picks that we can manipulate to get the guys we want and positions we need. You're just off the deep end and refusing to acknowledge it.

And IMO, you're only doing that because you're on this agenda to make everything a negative. Why that is I just don't get. It doesn't make sense to be so incredibly hopeless about this team. Maybe you just let your personal issues cloud your view on everything.

Swift Is a Die Hard · 03-20-2013, 01:35 PM

(03-20-2013 01:29 PM)Beef Wrote: I guess you missed the part where multiple doctors have cleared Jarvis Jones and said he was misdiagnosed with spinal stenosis. He doesn't have that condition and never has. And he's not an injury prone player.

And again, that's all fantasy stuff. I'm not claiming this is what we will do. But you're acting like there's nothing left, that we're done, and we're going to be horrible no matter who we draft.

We have cap space to do more and we have a lot of picks that we can manipulate to get the guys we want and positions we need. You're just off the deep end and refusing to acknowledge it.

And IMO, you're only doing that because you're on this agenda to make everything a negative. Why that is I just don't get. It doesn't make sense to be so incredibly hopeless about this team. Maybe you just let your personal issues cloud your view on everything.

Its negative cause I dont like the direction this team is going and so far the only direction we are going has proven to be regular season successful but not built for playoffs. Now we lose a important defensive player and a good rotational player in Walker. TD keeps seeing this team as a WIN now team and that is evident by signing a 30 year old rb and bring back Tony G for 1 more season. He is tearing down this defense to nothing while still trying to win with offense

5 draft picks for Julio was dumb. still do this date no matter how special Julio is Ravens didnt need a Julio to win a Super Bowl they have built through the draft and build through it. That is why they are successful in post season and have won super bowls

The direction this team should have went with was YOUNGER on OFFENSE TE,RB
to be around with Ryan and Julio and brought in veteran DEFENSIVE PLAYERS LIKE ABE AND OSI/ELVIS to help teach the and guide the young drafted defensive players..

I am telling you the window is closing on this team. We will be a playoff team cause Smith is a great head coach and Ryan is a very good QB and Julio and Roddy but after this season and I see this season as 11-5 and one and done in playoffs with this defense just like how GB is struggling on defense no matter how good QB play is ..

Beef · 03-20-2013, 01:36 PM

(03-20-2013 01:23 PM)Swift Is a Die Hard Wrote: Turner didnt have a great game vs Seahawks ? Turner was hurt in 2nd half of SF49ERS game he hurt his ankle. The game plan was not to run vs 49ers.
Both sides are to blame. More like the mistakes of Ryan, the fumble and int hurt the momentum and when he had a chance to win the game on the drive he came up short. Koetter also made some questionable play calls. It was a team LOSS but our defense should have put together a better effort vs two young QBs

We didnt lose in playoffs cause lack of rushing game. we lost cause our LBS were exposed in pass coverage and our run defense was shredded in 49ers games and add the mistakes Ryan and offense made with the fumble snap and int

Again you're just not being honest here.

The rushing game did play a part. They failed to convert on short yardage several times and this put 49'ers offense back on the field.

And you're not giving enough credit to the 49'ers offense. Keaperdouche has a good arm and is mobile in the pocket and fairly accurate with his throws. Gore is a damn good RB. Davis runs a 4.4 as a 250 lb TE. They had the best OL statistically in the league too.

It's pretty hard for any team to stop that offense when it's clicking. Some how we did it the entire first half and then they made good adjustments and we absolutely gave them the ball back one too many times. Convert ONE more short yardage first down and kick a fieldgoal instead of punt and the INT and fumble become irrelevant. We failed to convert THREE short yardage first downs.

Swift Is a Die Hard · 03-20-2013, 01:40 PM

(03-20-2013 01:36 PM)Beef Wrote: Again you're just not being honest here.

The rushing game did play a part. They failed to convert on short yardage several times and this put 49'ers offense back on the field.

And you're not giving enough credit to the 49'ers offense. Keaperdouche has a good arm and is mobile in the pocket and fairly accurate with his throws. Gore is a damn good RB. Davis runs a 4.4 as a 250 lb TE. They had the best OL statistically in the league too.

It's pretty hard for any team to stop that offense when it's clicking. Some how we did it the entire first half and then they made good adjustments and we absolutely gave them the ball back one too many times. Convert ONE more short yardage first down and kick a fieldgoal instead of punt and the INT and fumble become irrelevant. We failed to convert THREE short yardage first downs.

The Falcons offense failed to convert on short yardage situation in Giants playoff game. It has more to do with interior push with McClure, Blalock inside and Konz wasnt great last year either. Turner is a north/south runner give him a hole he gets through. he doesnt have speed to separate from 2nd tier. Look at QUIZZ IS YPC ?

was quizz a problem last year, he only ran for a 3.9 YPC ..system and run blocking is a issue

Swift Is a Die Hard · 03-20-2013, 01:42 PM

as for Jones if he falls to 15-22 area its worth a risk but to give up a future first to jump to 9-14 not worth it at all. If anything might as well trade out and try and make a run at Clowney next season / With a 9-7 record with our defense and a extra first from a trade out we might be able to put together a package for Clowney next season

Beef · 03-20-2013, 02:09 PM

(03-20-2013 01:35 PM)Swift Is a Die Hard Wrote: Its negative cause I dont like the direction this team is going and so far the only direction we are going has proven to be regular season successful but not built for playoffs. Now we lose a important defensive player and a good rotational player in Walker. TD keeps seeing this team as a WIN now team and that is evident by signing a 30 year old rb and bring back Tony G for 1 more season. He is tearing down this defense to nothing while still trying to win with offense

5 draft picks for Julio was dumb. still do this date no matter how special Julio is Ravens didnt need a Julio to win a Super Bowl they have built through the draft and build through it. That is why they are successful in post season and have won super bowls

The direction this team should have went with was YOUNGER on OFFENSE TE,RB
to be around with Ryan and Julio and brought in veteran DEFENSIVE PLAYERS LIKE ABE AND OSI/ELVIS to help teach the and guide the young drafted defensive players..

I am telling you the window is closing on this team. We will be a playoff team cause Smith is a great head coach and Ryan is a very good QB and Julio and Roddy but after this season and I see this season as 11-5 and one and done in playoffs with this defense just like how GB is struggling on defense no matter how good QB play is ..

TD has been building this team in the draft though.

In 2007 this team was in shambles, missing tons of pieces to be a winning team, much less playoffs or SB. No QB, no RB, Roddy was immature and dropping everything, no TE, no other WR's, and a pedestrian OL. The defense had old as fuck mediocre guys eating up tons of cap space.

TD only has 7 picks in a draft and history has proven that you're lucky to hit on even 2 of them in any given year. Some teams are luckier than others while some teams can't hit on a single player over multiple years.

TD got us our franchise QB. Turner was a gem. Roddy grew up and balled out. Abe was a pass rushing machine. Tony added an entire dimension to the offense that very few teams get. Grimes came out of no where to be a top-5 pass defender. Spoon is a stat machine on his way to multiple pro-bowls. Lofton was a tackling beast inside. Moore, now that healthy, has proven to be a top tier SS and improving every year. Asante has lived up to his hype and given us an edge we were missing.

Only so many moves can be made in a given year and only so many will hit and make a big impact. What TD has done since the pile of turds we fielded in 2007 has been very good. He has hit on way more than most other teams have. But we also had WAY more holes to fill than most other teams had.

To expect us to have been 100% fixed and elite everywhere enough to win multiple playoffs and have already been to the SB is simply unreasonable.

To expect it in 2008, no way. 2009, pushing it because we still had a bunch of holes to fill. 2010, ok make the playoffs is a reasonable expectation. To win and go to the NFCCG or SB, no. Still too many holes, plus now the bandaid we called Mike Mularkey had become so obnoxiously predictable, there's too much standing in the way.

Now 2011, the only issue I have is that we held on to Mularkey a year too long. If there's ONE THING I can get upset about, it's that. We likely had the talent to do better in 2011, but MM fucked us. No way we were going to overcome his scheme.

And 2012, we almost made it. It should have been our year, but fucking Turner can't get a damn yard to save his life and Abe either couldn't get to the passer anymore or was hurt. And, Grimes was missing and we clearly had a couple holes at LB.

It's not for lack of trying by TD though. The move to get Julio took the offense over the top... until Turner stopped running. We now had a legit OC and DC. And then the last draft TD drafted OL and DL and re-signed Abe and tried to bring in another highly touted DE. Edwards being a douche was not in the plans. Dent under-performing expectations was not in the plans. Nicholas under-performing in coverage was not in the plans. Grimes getting hurt was not in the plans. Turner falling off a cliff was not in the plans.

So much bad has happened that's out of TD's control, and yet we still were 1 game from the SB. We wouldn't have even been this close if not for all the good moves he's made.

TeamPlayer1 · 03-20-2013, 02:16 PM

Beef,

This is exactly the way the parole board has to deal with Charles Manson. At the end of the session they say "WTF?"