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RadioSilence · (This post was last modified: 10-03-2011 02:25 PM by RadioSilence.)

Whether you blame Mularkey, VanGorder, the O Line, M. Ryan, M. Smith, Dimitroff or ALL of them; the main reason why we're not very good right now is that...

we're on pace to give up 52 sacks while sacking opposing QBs only 20 times.

Anomaly · 10-03-2011, 02:28 PM

We didn't allow any sacks this week, so at least there was some improvement on that.

RadioSilence · 10-03-2011, 02:38 PM

(10-03-2011 02:28 PM)Va Falcon 88 Wrote: We didn't allow any sacks this week, so at least there was some improvement on that.

True - before Sunday we were on pace to give up 69 sacks while sacking the opposition 27 times. Improvement in protection, but we haven't recorded a sack on defense since week 1.

The projected "end-year stats" COULD be even worse after the GB game. Not counting us out yet, but this has been a consistent problem.

Jesus · 10-03-2011, 02:51 PM

Green Bay and New England are both on a pace to shatter the most passing yards allowed set by the 95 Falcons.

Defenses are wacky this year. I think it has to do with the rule changes and increase in passing around the league. The Packers are vulnerable. We can beat them if we never take our foot off the gas this sunday. We did that last year when we met the Packers the first time around. The funny thing is they have allowed nearly 1500 yards passing but allowed just 284 yards rushing. We have the firepower its time to unleash it.

**Radical** · 10-03-2011, 03:20 PM

What you're seeing is the result of having a young defense, with new players, in a mostly zone type scheme, with no off-season to work with.

Zone schemes work, they do, and anyone who says they don't are talking out their ass. The crux though is that they require cohesiveness and harmony from the coverage unit. One player needs to know when to let someone go and the other guy needs to know when to pick a guy up. It's very clear to me right now that not everyone is where they need to be. This is why the Patriots have given up more passing yards than anyone in the league, because they run a very complex zone scheme that requires smart and instinctive football players.

Looking at the higher ranked pass defense teams, most of them are either man coverage type defenses(Jets, Bengals) or they're defenses are loaded with experienced players(Steelers, Ravens).

The Don™ · (This post was last modified: 10-03-2011 05:20 PM by The Don™.)

(10-03-2011 03:20 PM)Radical Wrote: What you're seeing is the result of having a young defense, with new players, in a mostly zone type scheme, with no off-season to work with.

Zone schemes work, they do, and anyone who says they don't are talking out their ass. The crux though is that they require cohesiveness and harmony from the coverage unit. One player needs to know when to let someone go and the other guy needs to know when to pick a guy up. It's very clear to me right now that not everyone is where they need to be. This is why the Patriots have given up more passing yards than anyone in the league, because they run a very complex zone scheme that requires smart and instinctive football players.

Looking at the higher ranked pass defense teams, most of them are either man coverage type defenses(Jets, Bengals) or they're defenses are loaded with experienced players(Steelers, Ravens).

Well, it's not exactly working as evidenced by Tavaris Jackson having a career day on us.....We make bad QBs look good too many times..BVG and Smith have been trying to make their scheme work for four years now...Either their zone schemes aren't great and/or our players aren't very smart and instinctive...Our struggles have mainly come from the pass defense..Our run defense has improved so I will give them that...But sometimes, its more effective to simplify the defense, especially for a young defense, and a defense that hasn't been good in the passing department...Just let them go out there and play w/o instilling so many complex schemes and having them think more than rather just playing out there

Beef · 10-03-2011, 06:53 PM

The 3-3-5 shit is what's irritating me. Some how, we have 8 defenders between the 2nd and 3rd layer and yet Mike Williams, Ben Obomanu, and Doug Baldwin are catching balls in open space without a defender within 10 feet of them. I mean I can understand Sidney Rice, but come on.

I was watching that game in the second half shouting outloud in my livingroom, "Wait a second, we're only rushing 3 and Tarvaris f'ing Jackson is carving us up with his arm!?!?"

It's maddening.

AsylumGuido · (This post was last modified: 10-03-2011 07:14 PM by AsylumGuido.)

(10-03-2011 06:53 PM)Beef Wrote: The 3-3-5 shit is what's irritating me. Some how, we have 8 defenders between the 2nd and 3rd layer and yet Mike Williams, Ben Obomanu, and Doug Baldwin are catching balls in open space without a defender within 10 feet of them. I mean I can understand Sidney Rice, but come on.

I was watching that game in the second half shouting outloud in my livingroom, "Wait a second, we're only rushing 3 and Tarvaris f'ing Jackson is carving us up with his arm!?!?"

It's maddening.

While it wasn't maddening to me, Beef, it was surprising. We were beaten by Williams, who is a huge beast, several times, but it was Hasselbeck at QB. I was surprised at how Jackson, who I always saw as a hack in Minny, kept making plays like that. The zone just doesn't close when it is supposed to. It is keeping those pockets open. I'm not sure if that is because of bad design or bad execution or a combination of the two, but if it continues I'm expecting the Saints to be facing a 4-4 Falcons team in week ten and exploiting the same.

juraitwaluzka · 10-03-2011, 09:35 PM

(10-03-2011 07:14 PM)AsylumGuido Wrote: While it wasn't maddening to me, Beef, it was surprising. We were beaten by Williams, who is a huge beast, several times, but it was Hasselbeck at QB. I was surprised at how Jackson, who I always saw as a hack in Minny, kept making plays like that. The zone just doesn't close when it is supposed to. It is keeping those pockets open. I'm not sure if that is because of bad design or bad execution or a combination of the two, but if it continues I'm expecting the Saints to be facing a 4-4 Falcons team in week ten and exploiting the same.

If it continues that's exactly what you're going to see.

I have no problem with zone, hell most any system works if it is executed properly. The problem is that we are not executing it and on top of that we seem to be just saying oh well, it's not working let's keep trying anyway. And worse it becomes utterly predictable. It seems obvious to me, if we can see what's coming most of the time from the couch it's no wonder the opposition is feasting. I mean c'mon an offense is going to take what a defense is giving them and we just keep giving them the same thing. Once they figure out what in their arsenal works against it they continue to do it with success because we seem unwilling to adjust.

What's the most frustrating to me is that we have seen the changes made before, we know they can do it, but we always just seem to revert back to the default. The 2nd saints game last year is a great example. Even in the loss our defense was creative and overall played outstanding (unfortunately for us, so did the saints defense).

I think it's stubbornness in their system instead of adjusting to the talent. Unfortunately it's an ingrained philosophy and the best we can hope for is that the players learn to execute the system because I don't see the system changing, on the radio show tonight Smitty was talking about the benefits of the 3-3-5 so expect to see more of it.

ggp · 10-03-2011, 10:04 PM

(10-03-2011 03:20 PM)Radical Wrote: What you're seeing is the result of having a young defense, with new players, in a mostly zone type scheme, with no off-season to work with.

Zone schemes work, they do, and anyone who says they don't are talking out their ass. The crux though is that they require cohesiveness and harmony from the coverage unit. One player needs to know when to let someone go and the other guy needs to know when to pick a guy up. It's very clear to me right now that not everyone is where they need to be. This is why the Patriots have given up more passing yards than anyone in the league, because they run a very complex zone scheme that requires smart and instinctive football players.

Looking at the higher ranked pass defense teams, most of them are either man coverage type defenses(Jets, Bengals) or they're defenses are loaded with experienced players(Steelers, Ravens).

I am not sure that I agree with you. While you can argue that an inexperienced secondary takes time to "gell", can we apply this to our secondary?

The play that I have trouble forgetting is the TD allowed by Robinson late the game. I hear that there was a miscommunication between Robinson and DeCoud. Both players are veterans and they have a full season of experience playing together. A shortened preseason can create rustiness, but not a gaff this bad in the fourth regular season game.

There are some serious issues at hand. Not knowing where to place the blame, the first place I have to look is the coaching staff. I don't know who our secondary coach is but I would put some serious pressure on him to execute the scheme better. Failing that, I might consider moving to a simpler scheme.

Our OL is terrible and we will not be dominating the time of possession this season. For that reason, it is essential that our defense finally step up and shut offenses down.